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    What to watch at the Harris-Trump presidential debate

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    On Tuesday’s episode of The Excerpt podcast: USA TODAY Chief Political Correspondent Phillip M. Bailey takes a look at Tuesday night’s presidential debate in Philadelphia. Robert F. Kennedy Jr.’s name will appear on the Michigan presidential ballot, in a blow to former President Donald Trump. Commercial Appeal Criminal Justice Reporter Lucas Finton explains what’s at stake in the federal criminal trial centered on the death of Tyre Nichols. He was pulled over and beaten by five now-former Memphis police officers. The search intensifies for a Kentucky shooting suspect. James Earl Jones is dead at 93.

    Hit play on the player below to hear the podcast and follow along with the transcript beneath it.  This transcript was automatically generated, and then edited for clarity in its current form. There may be some differences between the audio and the text.

    Podcasts:  True crime, in-depth interviews and more USA TODAY podcasts right here

    Taylor Wilson:

    Good morning. I’m Taylor Wilson, and today is Tuesday, September 10th, 2024. This is The Excerpt. Today, the presidential debate is here, plus jury selection begins in the Tyre Nichols federal criminal trial, and the search continues for a Kentucky highway shooter.

    ♦

    Debate day in America is here tonight. Former President Donald Trump and Vice President Kamala Harris will square off on the debate stage in Philadelphia. I caught up with USA TODAY Chief Political Correspondent Phillip M. Bailey for a look ahead.

    Phillip, thank you for hopping on today. It’s another big week for politics.

    Phillip M. Bailey:

    Absolutely, Taylor, good seeing you.

    Taylor Wilson:

    So despite being Vice President and getting this big formal nomination at the convention last month, Kamala Harris is still really introducing herself and her policy aims to some. How big is this debate for her to present herself and her work to the nation and what danger could still be in it for her?

    Phillip M. Bailey:

    I spoke with a few experts who’ve studied and looked at past presidential debates, and many agree. Look, former President Trump, this is going to be his seventh presidential debate. I believe that’s our record number for any individual for the number of debates he’s participated in. So he’s the veteran here. He knows his way around. He’s a showman of course. He has certainly done different antics in the past. He’s known to lob personal insults, throw out a lot of falsehoods in these debates.

    So there’s going to be a lot of burden on the Vice President, who is no slouch when it comes to debating. She’s a district attorney, she’s a prosecutor. She’s been the sitting Vice President. She knows certainly how to handle herself as she did against Mike Pence in the 2020 vice presidential debate. But look, this is going to be more perilous for Harris who is still introducing herself to a large segment of the country who don’t really know what she stands for and what she would do if elected. Her policy positions on her website are still very thin. A lot of times it’s very hard to pin her down on certain elements. For example, where does she stand on minimum wage? She certainly favors increasing it, but at what level? That’s not really known to a lot of folks.

    So I think for voters, that sliver of voters who are still undecided but who might change their mind, I think that they’re going to be paying closer attention to the Vice President than former President Trump. He’s sort of the known commodity, right? A lot of his policies, particularly in this election cycle, Taylor, have been far more authoritarian, far more Draconian, far more robust and to the right, even compared to his 2016 run. But for the Vice President, because she’s that unknown commodity, I think a lot of folks are going to be wondering, “Well, who is she?”.

    Taylor Wilson:

    Yeah. Well, as you mentioned Phillip, we know Donald Trump has this tendency to stray into personal attacks, especially on the debate stage. What do experts say about the importance for him to tamp those down or ramp them up tonight? And what’s the expectation? Phillip really for his general strategy tonight?

    Phillip M. Bailey:

    Last night I was able to speak with former Virginia Governor Jim Gilmore, who himself twice ran for president including 2016 against Donald Trump. And his advice to the former president who he worked in his administration is, “Stay focused on the things and issues that voters care about. Border security, the ongoing inflation hangover around the economy. Talk about the pullout of Afghanistan and some of the failures of the Biden administration.” But as I pointed out to Governor Gilmore, Donald Trump is not known to be a disciplined messenger here. He often goes on tangents where he is rambling and talking more about his personal grievances in the court cases he’s faced more so than public policy or issues that voters on the right, particularly his base, care about. So he strays into this territory where he often does just dive right into personal attacks.

    And there are those who believe, look, Kamala Harris is only the second woman to be nominated by a major party for president. And there are those who fear that if he gets too deep into the personal attacks and too condescending or attacking Harris too much, that’ll come off to a lot of voters, particularly female voters, as sexist. The question for Donald Trump will be can he remain focused, can he remain disciplined enough to keep Harris on defense rather than allowing her to introduce herself and explain her views?

    Taylor Wilson:

    Phillip, you brought up Biden. How big will the Biden factor be on the debate stage after he dropped out earlier this year?

    Phillip M. Bailey:

    Republicans want to tag Harris as the true incumbent and anchor her to every controversial decision and bad outcome of the past four years. Again, talking to Governor Gilmore of Virginia, one of the things that’s really animating conservative voters in particular these past few weeks has been the Trump campaign relentless attacks on bringing up the botched 2021 evacuation ending the war in Afghanistan, which by the way, resulted in the death of 13 U.S. troops. The Trump campaign is talking about, again, reminding folks of inflation, saying Bidenomics is not working and then while at the same time playing clips of Harris saying, Bidenomics is working.

    The President, even though he’s not in the room, his agenda, his administration, will be, and this is a particular, I think for Harris because she’s the Vice President, right? And she has not, for the most part, other than I think capital gains tax proposals she came out with late last week, hasn’t parted that much from Joe Biden.

    Taylor Wilson:

    We’ve seen this fallout from Biden’s disastrous debate performance that’s kind of gotten us to this point. I’m curious, Phillip, what does that really tell us about how important debates still are in presidential elections and how big a deal tonight could be?

    Phillip M. Bailey:

    So the people who are most interested, Taylor, in watching the debate are the people who are the most partisan, who probably maybe already made their decision. In our USA TODAY Suffolk poll, roughly 90% of likely voters said their minds were already firmly made up, but about 8% indicated that they might change their mind, and about 1% say they’re undecided. That’s a small, small group of voters, but in a race this close that will mean something. If you’re a voter who still hasn’t made up your mind, perhaps this debate could be the deciding factor. And given the fact that we saw in June when Joe Biden staggered out there and did not look up to the job of being the candidate for the Democrats, that changed this entire race. So debates do matter because this entire campaign in 2024 has been defined by debate performance.

    Taylor Wilson:

    Phillip M. Bailey is USA TODAY’s Chief Political Correspondent. Great breakdown for us as always here. Thank you Phillip.

    Phillip M. Bailey:

    No problem, Taylor. See you soon.

    Taylor Wilson:

    USA TODAY Network will stream the ABC News Presidential Debate simulcast on the USA TODAY Channel available on most smart televisions and devices. You can tune in tonight at 9:00 p.m. Eastern Time.

    ♦

    Robert F. Kennedy Jr.’s name will appear on Michigan’s November presidential ballot over his objections, the Michigan Supreme Court ruled yesterday. The majority ruling reverses a Friday opinion from the Michigan Court of Appeals, which said there was no valid reason not to remove Kennedy’s name from the ballot as Kennedy requested when he suspended his campaign and endorsed former Republican President Donald Trump. The ruling is seen as a potential boost to Democratic Vice President Kamala Harris at the expense of Trump. That’s on the idea that if Kennedy’s name were not on the ballot, some of those aware of his endorsement might be more likely to cast their ballots for Trump. You can read more with a link in today’s show notes.

    ♦

    Jury selection is underway for the former officers in the Tyre Nichols Federal Criminal Trial in Memphis. I spoke with Commercial Appeal Criminal Justice Reporter Lucas Finton for a look at what’s at stake in the case.

    Lucas, thank you so much for making some time today on The Excerpt.

    Lucas Finton:

    Yeah, thanks for having me.

    Taylor Wilson:

    So Lucas, let’s just start here. A lot of time has passed since that January 2023 incident. Can you just reset the stage for us and refresh us on what happened to Tyre Nichols?

    Lucas Finton:

    He was beaten by five members of the Memphis Police Department, now former, they’ve been fired since. He was pulled over late on January 7th, 2023 by members of the Scorpion Unit, which stands for Street Crimes Operation to Restore Peace In Our Neighborhoods, which was meant to be a specialized unit focusing on violent crime but court records showed that most of the offenses that were charged by officers in the unit were minor traffic infractions, nonviolent drug possession charges, felon in possession of a handgun charges, things of that nature.

    And it’s not clear why he was pulled over. Initially it was said that he was driving recklessly, but later Chief CJ Davis said there was no evidence that he was driving recklessly. Footage that has been released shows that when one officer gets there, there was already a confrontation with one of the officers yelling at Tyre Nichols to get out of the car. Eventually, he’s pulled out, taken to the ground and they start to pepper spray him, yell conflicting commands at him. At some point there, he’s able to get up and he runs away. He’s eventually tackled by other officers who find him. And this happens about 100 meters from his mother’s house, and authorities have said that he was running home at the time.

    And those officers hold him by his arms, proceed to kick, punch, hit him with a baton, pepper spray him for multiple minutes before they prop him up next to an unmarked police car. And then he’s taken to the hospital some minutes later in critical condition, dies three days later. His autopsy said that he was killed by blunt force trauma to the head and manner of death listed as homicide.

    Taylor Wilson:

    It’s absolutely brutal. So the Federal Criminal Trial has begun this week there in Memphis where you are Lucas. Who is on trial here and why? Really what’s at stake in this case?

    Lucas Finton:

    There were five officers charged. Two have entered guilty pleas, Desmond Mills Jr. and Emmett Martin III. They’ve pleaded guilty. Those charges include use of excessive force and conspiracy to witness tamper. Desmond Mills Jr. was recommended to serve 15 years in federal prison and Emmett Martin III, 40 years. The judge ultimately has the final say in what those sentences will be, but that’s what the recommendation from the government is on those two.

    That leaves three other former officers, Taddarius Bean, Demetrius Haley, and Justin Smith, who are on trial right now. Those three are charged with use of excessive force, deliberate indifference, conspiracy to witness tamper, and witness tampering. The maximum penalty for those charges if they’re convicted would be death, but the U.S. Attorney’s Office has said they’re not seeking the death penalty in this case, which would make a maximum sentence life in prison. And the federal system doesn’t have parole, so they would have to serve that entire sentence.

    Taylor Wilson:

    So Lucas, what happened on the first day yesterday and did proceedings go smoothly?

    Lucas Finton:

    There was a last minute sealed motion filed that was heard also under seal, so there was no media, no public allowed at that time. That started arguments at 8:30 and stretched on well past when trial was set to start. Trial was set to start at 9:30 a.m. Monday, but it wasn’t until around 11 a.m. that media and the public and Tyre Nichols’s family were able to enter the courtroom and the jury pool wasn’t brought in until just after noon. By the end of the day, which was around 6:00 p.m., seven potential jurors had been dismissed. The remaining jurors that are currently still in the box could be removed later though. We have about 200 jurors in this pool, attorneys still have not questioned the jurors yet though.

    Taylor Wilson:

    What happens next? How long can we expect this trial to last?

    Lucas Finton:

    They expect this trial to last between three and four weeks. The hope is that we will have a jury impaneled by the time that court closes this evening. We also got to look at who might testify during the case yesterday. Some of those names were former Scorpion unit members, and two of those were also officers that pleaded guilty, the aforementioned officers, Mills and Martin.

    We also found out that we might hear from two paramedics who we have not heard from and were not criminally charged in the case, but that went to take Tyre Nichols to the hospital that night. It’ll be the first time that we hear from them, and they’ve been cited in the civil lawsuit by Ben Crump and Rovon Wells, Tyre Nichols mother.

    Taylor Wilson:

    Lucas Finton is a criminal justice reporter with the commercial appeal in Memphis, part of the USA TODAY network. Lucas appreciate the time and insight on this.

    Lucas Finton:

    Thank you very much.

    ♦

    Taylor Wilson:

    Schools for 1,000s of students in multiple Kentucky counties were closed yesterday and residents were warned to lock their doors, keep porch lights on, and remain vigilant as the hunt for a gunman who injured five people in an interstate shooting spree rolled into its third day. Authorities have been combing through deep woods in rural parts of the state and warned that the suspect, identified as Joseph A. Couch, should be considered armed and dangerous. A spokesperson for the Laurel County Sheriff’s Office said deputies responding to a 911 call at about 5:30 p.m. Saturday, found vehicles parked along the I-75 Interstate riddled with bullet holes. Authorities later determined that at least a dozen vehicles had been hit. Some of the wounded were severely injured. Officials said initial reports indicated the shooting was a road rage incident between two vehicles, but officers later determined the shooter was camped out near an exit and was shooting at passing cars.

    ♦

    James Earl Jones has died. The acclaimed star of both stage and screen one Emmy, Grammy, Oscar, and Tony Awards, and his legendary voice would become one of his most famous attributes. He played Mufasa in the Lion King and was perhaps best known for one of the most famous lines in movie history as Star Wars’ Darth Vader telling Luke, “I am your father.” He also had a prolific career on Broadway, winning Tonys for The Great White Hope and Fences. Jones spent his early years in Mississippi before being raised by his grandparents in Michigan, and he overcame a stutter in early childhood. James Earl Jones was 93.

    ♦

    Thanks for listening to The Excerpt. You can get the podcast wherever you get your pods, and if you’re on a smart speaker, just ask for The Excerpt. I’m Taylor Wilson and I’ll be back tomorrow with more of The Excerpt from USA TODAY.

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