This is an audio transcript of the Life and Art from FT Weekend podcast episode: ‘Culture chat — ‘Wicked’ hits the high notes’

Lilah Raptopoulos
Hi, listeners, this is Lilah. I am getting on before we start this episode to share some big news, which is that this show is ending at the end of this year. It has been an absolute honour to host this podcast. I’ve hosted versions of it for more than five years, and that’s hundreds of episodes, hundreds more of guests, hundreds of thousands of listeners, if not more. And I just want to thank you. That said, I am not here to say goodbye just yet. I’m here because we have a bit more than a month left. And I want to ask you something. A lot of you know me by now. You know that I love questions so much. My currency is questions. I work in questions. And as a way to celebrate this show, I’m hoping that you might send me one question that you think I could help you answer before we’re done.

I’m asking because I would like our last episode to answer listeners’ questions as the show has really always been about you. Your question could really be anything. As you know, I have access to all of your favourite FT people and more. So you can ask something with a guest in mind. Like maybe you have a question for our foreign editor, Alec Russell. Or you want advice about film or music or art or food from our critics. You can also just share a question with me that’s been rolling around in your mind that you’re looking for a better way to think about, and then I will find someone who I think can give you the most interesting answer.

So send me that question by email. You can email me at [email protected], that’s in the show notes. You can also message me on Instagram @lilahrap. I see all of those. And if you want to keep following my work, the best way to do that is to find me on Instagram or Substack and follow me there. I will share what’s next as soon as I can. OK. Thank you, thank you, thank you, thank you, thank you. On to the show.

Welcome to Life and Art from FT Weekend. I’m Lilah Raptopoulos and this is our Friday chat show. Today we are talking about Wicked, the movie musical that’s out today based on the legendary Broadway show. Wicked is a loose prequel to The Wizard of Oz, and it follows its two-star witches: Glinda the good witch, played in the film by pop star Ariana Grande and the wicked witch of the west, played by Cynthia Erivo. We see the two of them meet in school. Glinda is a popular blonde do-gooder and Elphaba is a green-skinned social outcast with a cute, magical powers. The two become nemeses and then close friends until they eventually choose different paths.

(MOVIE CLIP PLAYING)

Lilah Raptopoulos
This film is just act one of the story. Act two has already been shot and it will be released at the same time next year. It’s been a buzzy process. The film was in development for over a decade. It was delayed for five years and it cost $145mn to make — making it one of the year’s biggest cinematic risks. So how did it do? Let’s get into it.

I’m Lilah in New York and when my bubble closes up around me, I can’t hear you. To my left in the New York studio, she and I just did an interpretive dance together at the school ball and at least one of us cried. It’s the FT’s US media editor, Anna Nicolaou. Welcome, Anna.

Anna Nicolaou
Hi, Lilah.

Lilah Raptopoulos
Hi, Anna. Thanks for coming. To my right, we are all together in the same room. He taught me what shoes to wear, how to fix my hair, the proper poise when I talk to boys. This man has been trying to make me popular for years. It’s the FT’s senior corporate finance correspondent, Eric Platt.

Eric Platt
Hi, Lilah.

Lilah Raptopoulos
Hi, Eric.

Eric Platt
It’s so nice to be here.

Lilah Raptopoulos
It’s such a pleasure.

Eric Platt
Total joy!

Lilah Raptopoulos
OK, so before we get into what we thought, I thought we could maybe set the scene for how we saw this film. Anna, you finagled all three of us into the New York premiere of this film at Moma, the Museum of Modern Art. What did we see?

Movie clip
We saw. . . It was definitely unusual, I would say. So there had been an official LA premiere on, I think, Saturday. And then this was on the following Thursday. And this was effectively kind of like a New York’s party for Wicked. It wasn’t really an official premiere. So, yeah, we were at the Moma, it felt weirdly casual at times, if you know what I mean. Like, it was this bizarre mix of high and low where like, there were all these fashion people and it was hosted by Anna Wintour, who apparently had insisted that the whole thing happen in the first place because she’s very into Broadway. And then, of course, the stars were there and there was a red carpet.

Lilah Raptopoulos
So we saw Ariana Grande and Cynthia Erivo and Jeff Goldbloom, you know, chatting with Anna Wintour.

Movie clip
Yeah. And then Jon Chu — the director — introduced the film. But we basically watched it in. . . I didn’t even know the Moma had a theatre.

Lilah Raptopoulos
Sort of a sad underground theatre.

Eric Platt
An auditorium, yes?

Lilah Raptopoulos
Yeah. A little auditorium.

Anna Nicolaou
Yeah, I guess they closed the museum early that day. It all felt like a little, like, illegal. You know what I mean? Like just being in a museum like that when you’re, like, after hours.

Lilah Raptopoulos
Yeah.

Eric Platt
I’m still irked by the fact there was no popcorn or Diet Coke, and they gave out red vines and boxed water. That was my real takeaway.

Lilah Raptopoulos
Yeah, we were all starving.

Lilah Raptopoulos
OK, so tell me now, separated from all the buzz. Where are you coming to Wicked from? And what did you actually think of the movie, Eric?

Eric Platt
It was fantastic. I would highly recommend it to anyone. So I come to Wicked from seeing the Broadway musical. I’d seen the musical once probably when I first moved to New York, and then I saw it again recently. And this would have been like 2022 for a friend’s birthday. And this friend has seen Wicked maybe 12 or 13 times. They have a list of, you know, all the best Elphabas. And it was interesting coming to it then because you can see the play in the musical in a very different light. Because it is quite dark and that will not come across maybe in the marketing materials.

Lilah Raptopoulos
So you thought it was fantastic. What did you like most about it?

Eric Platt
I thought it stayed so true to the Broadway productions, right? Nothing was lost. In fact, if anything, it really elevated the show. It was kind of a bit like seeing Chicago from the stage to the movie. It really. . . They were able to add something to it and the storytelling was much more finessed than in Broadway where like in Defying Gravity, right? The finale of Act one, they speed through that in the musical, right? It’s four minutes. That scene in the movie is stretched out to ten minutes and they really give it the kind of like space to breathe. And it makes a lot more sense.

Lilah Raptopoulos
Yeah. Anna, what do you think?

Anna Nicolaou
I really liked it. I would say I’m a casual Wicked fan. Like I saw it in . . . when I was in high school, and I think it was probably a year or two after it came out on Broadway. So it was still relatively new at that time. And then I don’t really think about it much in my daily life. But I’ve always liked the songs a lot. And I really liked the movie, actually. I thought it was really well done. I thought the two leads were amazing. I sort of felt like if they weren’t so good, it might have been a bit of a mess. As in I felt like it really demanded them to, like, really, like, bring everything to it and they pulled it off. But if it had been like a lesser performer, I’m not sure if it would have worked.

Eric Platt
A hundred per cent agree. Like Ariana Grande’s comedic timing was spectacular.

Lilah Raptopoulos
I know. She’s funny.

Eric Platt
She’s funny. And it comes across in the movie. And it’s not. . . Like you could see a world where maybe she comes across a little overeager. And you don’t get that at all from this movie. She . . . it felt like the role was made for her.

Anna Nicolaou
Yeah. And we literally were laughing and crying during the show. We should admit that.

Lilah Raptopoulos
Yeah. I did. I did both laugh out loud and cry twice.

Eric Platt
Twice, yeah!

Lilah Raptopoulos
I came into this like all I wanted was to enjoy Ariana Grande and cry during Defying Gravity. And both happened, so I felt pretty good. But I came to it as a kind of a passive fan too. I’ve seen the show once in 2012. I watched The Wizard of Oz a lot as a kid. But this film was like. . . I felt sort of like you did, Anna. Like I had a wonderful time. It was like sumptuous and colourful and like, you felt like you wanted to eat it sort of. So I loved that. I loved them. They were amazing. And they were like fully in their characters. And maybe it’s all a ruse, but their chemistry seems, like, real.

But I did also do feel. . . felt a little like it was crowded. And I don’t really know if that’s just because that’s like the curse of a musical adaptation and they had to fit a lot in. But I felt a little like I was being whisked around sometimes really quickly. Like whisked through the Emerald City and whisked through some of those school scenes. And I like kind of wanted to sit in them a little bit longer, but that wasn’t really the point.

Eric Platt
Yeah, I think that makes because when you think about a Broadway production, right? The sets will change and that’ll indicate, you know, we’re at a new point in life and the timeline has shifted. You don’t really have that same thing with this movie if you’re trying to get every single song in. So suddenly. . . I think that’s why like people were complaining about the length, but actually they needed that time to kind of slow things down a little bit there. Otherwise, it would be a little harried.

Lilah Raptopoulos
It still felt fast and it was a 2.5-hour long movie. Yeah, really nuts.

Eric Platt
Yeah. We got home at 1am that night. I was like, it’s like it’s a school night.

Lilah Raptopoulos
Well, we were eating poke bowls next to Anna Wintour.

Anna Nicolaou
She did not eat, for the record.

Lilah Raptopoulos
Of course. I guess I’m wondering if you had any memorable scenes, any songs that represented what you liked or didn’t about the film. What sort of stood out to you when you think back on the film now?

Anna Nicolaou
I guess the ones that are the big songs, I thought Ariana’s “Popular” was just 10 out of 10.

(“POPULAR” PLAYING)

Anna Nicolaou
I thought the final scene . . . and I’m not usually into these really extended final scenes like, you know, in like an action film, I usually just get really pissed off. But it was just really good. And you really felt like the sense of triumph. Like at the very end of it, at least I felt it. And again. . . I also think that’s also Cynthia being so good at it. Just such a good singer and just . . . Yeah. I felt like it ended perfectly.

Eric Platt
Yeah. I would even say the opening number. . . There was some really interesting nuance in it because this is a spoiler if you haven’t seen the Broadway play.

Lilah Raptopoulos
It’s fine, it’s your fault.

Anna Nicolaou
You’ve had 20 years.

Eric Platt
Right. You know, actually that they’re friends, right? And so when you’re watching that first scene and, you know, everyone celebrating the death of Elphaba. And you actually, when you look at Ariana’s face, it’s pained at moments very subtly. And then she’s, you know, she’s trying to put on the show, which is what she does the entire musical, right, this performance advocacy at times, right? It’s this idea to be popular, to do what the masses want. But you can see she’s struggling with it. And I thought I was like, wow, OK, they’re really going for it here. They’re really trying to get this right.

Lilah Raptopoulos
Right. Yeah. I really liked a lot of little things. Again, I really liked Ariana Grande’s like comedic stuff. I liked this moment where the Wizard of Oz is played by Jeff Goldbloom, and he’s like showing them this vision for this future Oz, and he’s trying to figure out the colour of the brick road. And he’s like trying blue and green or whatever. And she chose this yellow and she’s like, it just says road to me. There’s like a lot of moments like that. She sort of like waved at one of the scary monkeys at one point and said, hello, sir. She’s good.

(MUSIC PLAYING)

Lilah Raptopoulos
OK. Why don’t we get a little deeper into this? I’m trying to get a sense of what this film and this play is about at its core and how well the film hit on the themes. Eric, I know you interviewed your friend who has seen this play 12 times. Did he help you get a sense of what this was really?

Eric Platt
He’s a really. . . He spoke for a while about kind of actually what comes up in this. And so in one part, it’s a story about a friendship between two women and their growth through childhood. It’s a story . . . it’s a deeply political story, right? It’s one where folks need a common enemy. And in the pursuit of power, people are willing to give them that. They’re willing to really put a veil over people’s eyes in pursuit of that. The whole idea that she melted because of a pot of water, right, or a pail of water, is wild. And yet people are willing to believe that because they want . . . they need a common enemy.

And I think it’s interesting because this musical came out in 2003. This is right after 9/11. It’s right after the US has invaded Iraq. The main character’s green, right? This is a story about someone who’s literally being othered by the rest of society. You could say this is a story about race, right? Like, why is she being ostracised for this? And so I think there’s so much there that it’s hitting on.

Lilah Raptopoulos
Do you think the film tapped into that theme well? I kind of felt like it really did. I felt like when I left, I was thinking about this idea that, like, societies need an enemy or someone to hate. And I was thinking about how . . . we watched it after Trump was elected. And like, there is this conversation happening that Republicans used or Trump used migrants as like a scapegoat for why people are so economically depressed or struggling. And it really worked. And the Democrats, like all they could use was Donald Trump. They didn’t use billionaires. They didn’t use some other enemy, but they needed a better enemy. And yeah, it turns out we do prefer as a society to hate outsiders.

Eric Platt
Right. The whole arc of animals shouldn’t be allowed to speak, right?

Lilah Raptopoulos
Yeah. Big animal welfare.

Eric Platt
But it’s. . . are we talking about animals or we talking about which people shouldn’t have a voice? Right? That’s the thread of this, right?

Anna Nicolaou
Yeah, I agree with all of that. I think. . . I mean, it’s interesting because I don’t know that I’ve really thought about this that thoroughly before. But The Wizard of Oz is one of my favourite movies. And that is such a political story as well. And they’re both such American stories, it feels like. Like both of them I feel like the plot could apply to whatever is happening politically in this country in any given decade, which is really interesting because you look at them on the surface and they don’t seem that complicated. But this, I think and that’s what’s interesting and obviously, look, it is kind of an inversion of The Wizard of Oz, but I think it’s interesting that they both kind of expertly tap into this American strife that is sometimes hard to articulate.

(MUSIC PLAYING)

I’m curious whether the fact that there’s so much behind it sort of makes it tortured in any way or tortures it in any way. I’ve been thinking about how, like Wicked is this remake of a remake of a remake. Let me see if I can get this right. It’s a film adaptation of the musical Wicked, which is a loose adaptation of the 1995 Gregory Maguire novel Wicked, which in turn is a revisionist exploration of the L. Frank Baum book from 1900 — The Wonderful Wizard of Oz — which is, of course, related to its 1939 musical film adaptation with Judy Garland, The Wizard of Oz. And then that’s all unrelated to The Wiz, which is the 74 Broadway black reimagining of The Wizard of Oz, which also was adapted into a musical. And yeah, it’s a lot. And I’m wondering if it feels like kind of tortured by that or if it’s, like, not a big deal.

Eric Platt
But don’t you love that? Like, I think in fashion, right? Like we’re constantly remaking the same thing, right? Like, when was the bar . . . when did Dior create the bar jacket, right? But we’re still reworking that because it has staying power, right? I think that’s the same here. There’s like these really interesting themes and that’s why it’s getting sliced and diced into so many different vehicles. And when I think of Wicked itself coming to the movies, it was initially meant to go to movies before the Broadway adaptation. Like the rights were bought ages ago, I believe, by Universal.

Lilah Raptopoulos
Oh, interesting.

Eric Platt
And they were sitting on them because they didn’t know what made most sense, right? Should this be a drama? How do you do this? And so all this time for two decades, right? Universal’s had the right to turn this into a film and just suddenly now, like, enough time had passed. It’s still doing gangbusters at the box office in New York. But it wasn’t like, it wasn’t like doing the Rent movie so close to the Rent, you know, production on Broadway, whereas this feels like there’s kind of an open field for it to land.

Lilah Raptopoulos
Yeah. Yeah. Do you feel that way or does it feel like. . . 

Anna Nicolaou
I agree. I mean, the cynical take would be that we’re lacking in new ideas in kind of the creative world in general. Like so next week when it comes out, the other big movie coming out is Moana 2, which is just another Disney remake. But I also agree. I don’t think. . . It doesn’t feel laboured at this point, in spite of this very extensive press tour. And I think it’s because I hadn’t, like, I’m a very, like avid, consumer of pop culture. I hadn’t really been thinking about Wicked in a while until this movie came around. So it did. . . It doesn’t feel old to me strangely. What do you think?

Lilah Raptopoulos
Also, it’s funny everything. . . Well, I just. . . The one of the most popular. . . When we do More or Less the most popular More or Lesses we get as people saying like less remakes, more original ideas, less remakes, more original ideas. And so we have to actually tell people, please don’t say less remakes any more because people are so sick of it. But actually, I mean, when I saw an ad for this, I feel like last Christmas there was a preview for it, I was like, hell yeah, this is good. This is my Dune.

Anna Nicolaou
Yeah, like, just let us have this.

Lilah Raptopoulos
So, yeah, so it’s OK. Less remakes, but like, if they’re good remakes. Yeah, there’s not. . . 

Anna Nicolaou
This one feels legitimate.

Lilah Raptopoulos
Yeah, this is legit. They also really did all the stuff. They like, planted 9mn tulips to, like, do that scene with the tulips. You know, Ariana Grande, like, changed her voice in a number of ways. And they really, like, they committed. If you’re gonna do it. . . 

Eric Platt
Yeah, it was fascinating because Ariana Grade did a stint on RuPaul’s Drag Race after or in between filming. And you could actually tell that her, like, her voice had changed from . . . this must have aired like in ’22 or something like this. . . Or ’23. Like you could tell something had shifted. Not just her, like, natural ageing.

Lilah Raptopoulos
Yeah. She said that that’s because everybody gave her a hard time because they acted like she was being fake. But she was like, no, I’m consciously protecting my voice for this film.

(MUSIC PLAYING)

For the last part of our conversation, I’m curious what makes a good film adaptation of a Broadway musical in your opinions?

Eric Platt
I think the casting is critical, right? I think you need someone who can really sing, which is why it works so well here. Why it worked in Chicago, for instance. And you need to hopefully, like, the book that it all relies upon is like very kind of grand. Because that’s what you’re trying to do. You’re lifting something that’s like on a, what, 40-foot stage and turning it into like this giant production. And so you have to really kind of have the eye turn to translate that.

Lilah Raptopoulos
Yeah, I think like a wink to the audience is usually kind of a good thing. Just like there’s some, like, knowingness to it. Chicago had so much knowingness to it. Mamma Mia!, I would. . . Not everybody loves Mamma Mia! but I thought it was a delight. And there’s a total sort of wink to the audience.

Anna Nicolaou
I like the wink thing. Something to make it a little fresh. And I think this version of Wicked did have that. It felt modern. But I agree with Eric, I think it’s. . . Number one is the casting because Broadway requires real talent. You know what I mean? Like you can’t fake it when you’re performing live however many times per week. And I think that translates to the screen as well. It’s just a very demanding kind of acting and singing.

Eric Platt
It’s that ability to be super versatile, like, having that quiet moment, right, when Elphaba and Glinda are dancing together, when Glinda realises she’s wronged Elphaba by giving her the ugly hat to wear and she’s embarrassed her. To have that kind of like quietness and then minutes later be belting, it takes a range. Like that’s range. And not everyone has it, as we’ve seen in some movies.

Lilah Raptopoulos
Yeah. I think you made also a really good point at the beginning, which is that when you’re in a theatre, you’re aware of like the limitations of the theatre. So like the lights go down and they change the set and you like expect that and Act I ends. And then you come back for Act II and you expect that. And there’s only so much they can, I mean, do. But in films like you’re blind to all of that. So actually you have to figure out how to fill those holes well, so you don’t feel like you’re watching this, like, messy version of the play.

Eric Platt
I know. Exactly. Right? Like there was a lot added to this movie that wasn’t actually in the musical, right? Like the whole. . . Some of the conversation with the wizard, right? Some of the, in choosing the colour of the yellow brick road, right? Like all that was added and all of it was like to develop these characters also. Which I would almost argue you don’t have to do if you’re on Broadway, right? Because people. . . there’s not a close-up of your face, right? There isn’t this quiet moment because actually, like you are belting for the back of the house which is very different on theatre where like a zoom lens is gonna be right in your face. So it’s a different skill.

Lilah Raptopoulos
Yeah, that’s a really good point. Part two is coming out this time next year. Are you going?

Anna Nicolaou
I thought we were to see it together.

Eric Platt
I thought we were gonna film another podcast for this.

Anna Nicolaou
I’m fully locked in. Again I think I was an easy target audience. But I honestly do think the movie is quite good.

Eric Platt
Oh, agreed. I will be there. I’m seeing it again this weekend. So like. . . 

Anna Nicolaou
Really?

Lilah Raptopoulos
I gotta bring my niece. Yeah.

Eric Platt
It’ll be a doozy.

Lilah Raptopoulos
All right. Eric and Anna, thank you both so much. We’ll be back in just a minute for More or Less.

(MUSIC PLAYING)

Welcome back for More or Less, where each guest says one thing they want to see more of or less of culturally. Anna, what do you have?

Anna Nicolaou
Mine is very specific. I’ve been listening to this New York Times podcast about the whale from Free Willy. And I don’t know if this is my version of like baking sourdough, like during the pandemic, but it has really been a joy. And I just feel. . . It feels relevant, but it’s so different from everything else I’m learning about. And I think I just want more things like that. Things that are different from my usual, like, scrolling through the news. And I guess that’s probably on me. But yeah, more podcasts about whales, I guess, would be my more.

Lilah Raptopoulos
There are fewer narrative podcasts than there used to be. There you go. More about whales. OK. It’s called The Good Whale. Great. We’ll put it in the show notes.

Anna Nicolaou
Please do.

Lilah Raptopoulos
Eric.

Eric Platt
I have a less, actually. I want to see less of boxing and MMA, on Netflix or on any streaming platform. Get it out of here. And get some of the trashy reality television that’s also been on off of my screen. I want. . . If we’re gonna do reality, I want to see Survivor. Like, take me back to the good old days of like, let’s see how people are, like, coping and living with each other and the strategy. I don’t wanna see House of Villains. What is that? What am I watching?

Anna Nicolaou
What is House of Villains?

Eric Platt
House of Villains is a show on the E Network, which I had to watch in between watching that Jake Paul or whoever.

Anna Nicolaou
Wait, you watched that?

Eric Platt
Someone put this. . . Someone put this on.

Anna Nicolaou
I was gonna get to you after. You watch that?

Eric Platt
No, no, no. Someone put it on the television. I was at a party and I was like, you need to change this.

Anna Nicolaou
At a party?

Eric Platt
There’s a lot wrong with the sentence, obviously. But House of Villains is a show where they took the villains from reality shows over the last 20 years and they put them all in a house together and they, like, get voted out somehow. It’s like Teresa Giudice from The Real Housewives of New York.

Lilah Raptopoulos
Right. I liked her.

Eric Platt
It’s Wes from the Real World/Road Rules Challenge. It’s these names. Yeah, but it’s not television. It’s, I don’t know what it is. I want less of that.

Lilah Raptopoulos
I feel like maybe we’re gonna like that show. But otherwise, I totally agree.

Anna Nicolaou
Lilah and I were reacting positively to your description. But yeah.

Lilah Raptopoulos
Yeah I just want, yeah. That Jake Paul versus Ty . . . I mean . . . 

Anna Nicolaou
I mean, why did you watch it?

Lilah Raptopoulos
Because I want to know what America watches. I feel like I should. I’m. . . After this election. . . 

Anna Nicolaou
Stick with the whale. I mean, what a day to play.

Lilah Raptopoulos
Again, I’m in a radical acceptance phase right now. OK. I have a more. This is maybe the most important more to me that I’ve ever shared on this show. I feel it more strongly than any other more that I have recommended. I want more places to reliably dance to the hits in New York City. I think this is a problem for really big cities and smaller cities and small towns even do a much better job at this.

If you live in a small town that has like three bars, you know that on the weekend you can go to one of those bars and there’s gonna be a guy there or a woman doing a good enough job DJiing all the songs you want to hear. You’re gonna hear “We Found Love in a Hopeless Place”. You’re gonna hear “The Dog Days are Over”, which I know not everybody wants to hear, but it builds great on the dance floor. You’re gonna play “Tell Your Girlfriend”, you’re gonna play “Texas Hold’em”, whatever. When you live in New York, everyone is trying way too hard to be cool. You end up waiting in a line to get into a club that only plays house music or that only plays like 70s funk off of exclusively vinyl. And in my experience, I just can’t. . . you can’t let go.

Eric Platt
I feel like you’re attacking me right now. Like people want to go to Basement and they want to go to Knockdown Centre nowadays, yeah.

Lilah Raptopoulos
All right. Well, I want more. . . Like my. . . 

Anna Nicolaou
You want the hit.

Lilah Raptopoulos
I want the hits. I want DJs who aren’t trying, who are just playing pop. I want wedding reception bar. I want, you know, the good stuff. That’s what I want. So if any listeners know . . . 

Anna Nicolaou
It could be like the new counterculture. . . 

Lilah Raptopoulos
Of a place. Yeah, that’s true. All right. Yeah, the like anti-cool becomes cool or whatever.

Anna Nicolaou
Yeah, like people using, like, not smartphones.

Lilah Raptopoulos
Yes. Yes. I want to be at a bar using a flip phone.

Anna Nicolaou
That’s too far.

Anna Nicolaou
And dancing to some Taylor Swift song from 2006. All right. This is fun.

Eric Platt
This was great.

Anna Nicolaou
A delight.

Lilah Raptopoulos
Anna and Eric, thank you so much for being on the show.

Eric Platt
Thanks so much.

Anna Nicolaou
Thank you.

(MUSIC PLAYING)

Anna Nicolaou
That’s the show. Thank you for listening to Life and Art from FT Weekend. I’ve put links to the things we’ve discussed in the show notes. As I mentioned at the top, please do send me your questions. I’m on email at [email protected]. Again Instagram @lilahrap. All of that is in the show notes, too.

I’m Lilah Raptopoulos and here’s my outrageously talented team. Katya Kumkova is our senior producer. Lulu Smyth is our producer. Our sound engineers are Joe Salcedo, Sam Giovinco and the great Breen Turner. With original music by Metaphor Music. Topher Forhecz is our executive producer and our global head of audio is Cheryl Brumley. Have a lovely weekend and we’ll find each other again on Monday.